Rumors have been circulating for a month or so that Teen Mom 2 star Kail Lowry is pregnant. As faithful Roundup readers know, The Ashley will not write about rumors until she has reliable information.
However, now The Ashley can exclusively confirm that the rumors are true. Kail confirms exclusively to The Ashley that she is pregnant with her third child.
“I am about halfway through the pregnancy,” Kail confirmed to The Ashley.
Kail, who recently went through a divorce with Javi Marroquin, had previously denied the pregnancy rumors. (She confirms that Javi is not the father of the child she is carrying, but isn’t revealing who the father is at this time.)
“I know this isn’t the ideal situation, but those close to me have been very supportive and understanding,” Kail said.
Although Kail had said when she was with Javi that she didn’t want to have another child, she says she had a change of heart after the divorce.
“After seeing how little support I had during [my miscarriage with Javi’s baby], I truly thought I was done having kids and would finish school and focus on other things,” she says. “I started having [female] complications and was told my chances of ever carrying another baby to term were essentially cut in half.
“I realized that I did want another child eventually,” Kail adds. “I was told that as I get older, my chances of conceiving and carrying to term will be less and less. Long story short, the person I was with and I took the chance to see if I could get pregnant.”
Kail insists that she was prepared for the pregnancy, and was actually hoping to conceive.
“I have two boys now, and I wanted my kids to all be in the same age group,” Kail said. “If I wanted to have a third child, I knew it had to be relatively soon.
“I wasn’t shocked when I found out I was pregnant,” she said. “I was scared more than anything. For the first 12 weeks I checked for blood every time I went to the bathroom. I was scared to announce the pregnancy, and lose the baby.”
Kail says she’s fully prepared for ‘Teen Mom 2’ fans to react negatively but she’s excited about the baby. (For the record, she is not finding out the baby’s gender until he/she is born.)
“People are going to talk about me no matter what I do,” Kail said. “So I’m going to continue my life with people who really know and support me.”
Kail said that the pregnancy will be the topic of future ‘Teen Mom 2’ episodes, and that she will be posting more information about the pregnancy on her blog.
(Photo: MTV)
Congrads
All that will make this insane situation better is if the father is Keiffer.
Why is it that so many of these girls claim they have “fertility issues” when they become pregnant again? Such disregard for women who genuinely suffer from that reality day in and day out. Own your crap, ladies. You’re not fooling anyone.
It’s a toss up between 2 men. Whose the baby daddy? Quick……someone call Maury Povich
I agree with what many of her supporters are saying about her mental illness, but I don’t think it explains her CHOICES. She’s not impulsive, she’s calculating. I would also be more likely to believe that her bi-polar is to blame if mental illness wasn’t so prevalent among the TM cast and only appeared AFTER they’ve made some of the dumbest decisions known to humankind. Kailyn has said that she is bi-polar, but she also said she’s on medication for her issues. She sought a doctor’s help after the first time she beat up Javi, but even the meds couldn’t stop her from laying her hands on him once she sought treatment, which means she’s just an aggressive angry person. I don’t doubt that she has emotional problems, but she needs to own her behaviour. Not all of her actions can be explained away by her mental issues. Same goes for Leah feeding her kids Chunky soup straight outta the can or being high while driving her kids to school or being high with her sister and denying she still has a problem on camera every episode; or Catelynn’s claims that her “mental illness ruins everything,” Cate is lazy AF and selfish, that’s why she WON’T lose weight or spend quality time with her husband and baby. The only TM who’s been diagnosed and actually tries to make the best of the hand she’s been dealt is Jenelle, which is incredibly hard to believe when you look at her past impulsive and selfish behaviour, but you have to admit she’s come a long way from sleeping in her car with Kieffer. Then there’s Ambien, another master excuse maker. She was clearly high on the last reunion episode, her erratic behaviour and slurred speech tell me she’s using again and Dr. Drew is just in denial like everyone else who buys her excuses. There was no reason for her or Dr. Drew to come down on Gary when he was completely calm and agreeable throughout the entire segment, but Amber still lost it and cried about quitting the show. That is not the behaviour of a sober, healthy, and happy person. She whines non stop about not having her daughter but we’ve all seen how little effort she makes to actually see her child. By the time the reunion episode aired she hadn’t seen Leah in over a month despite the fact that she only lives 10 minutes from Gary and she had time for multiple plastic surgeries and time to launch her low rent clearinghouse clothing website. She leaves her parenting responsibilities to that live in gramps of hers while she spends her time with her “depression” in bed. Before you know it Dr. Drew will have to claim that teen pregnancy leads to mental illness because the number of TMOG and TM2 “mothers” who claim mental illness made them do it, is quickly outpacing the cast members who don’t blame mental illness for their stupidity. These girls don’t have mental issues, they’re just lazy, entitled brats.
All. Of. This.
3 kids 3 dads she’s a filthy hoe
She’s like a succubus. Javi helped her buy that big fancy house and once he comes back to the states it’s “get out of ‘my’ house”? Javi has every right to be in the house he helped pay for, she’s just lucky he gave in I guess and went and spent his first nights back in a hotel so she could try and conceive! AND people are going to defend her, “she had a hard choldhood” “she’s bipolar”. Then she should be working on herself, see a doctor, go to therapy. Not get knocked up by a random “friend” before the divorce that broke her oldest child’s heart is even final. Face it “Kail fans” (if there are any left) she has no excuse, she’s just a bitch.
Thaaaaannnkkk yooou!! I’m so sick of people saying “at least Kail is educated/has her degree!” because she doesn’t! She’s always pawing issac off on Jo to go to her night classes and she thinks having two kids, being pregnant with a child whose father doesn’t seem to be in the picture, and going to night classes is going to work? After issac she said she’d finish school, after lincoln, now it’ll be after the new baby till it just doesn’t happen at all. “I’m too busy. I have three kids! You try going to school with three kids!” Nobody made you have three kids Kail! And you said you’d finish school first so check your mouth next time you wanna complain! I like Javi, he’s gonna be another Jo. Everybody wants to rag on him because Kail made him look like an asshole when he’s really just trying to pick up the pieces she keeps dropping. She literally said she was divorcing Javi because he wanted more kids and she wanted to finish school, focus on herself, and enjoy life. Think about getting this news, “I’m divorcing you after getting your military benefits throughout our marriage because I don’t want to have anymore kids and you do… btw I’m pregnant because I just wanted to see if it was possible to have another baby.” Who does that? She never loved Javi because of she did she could never do that to him.
I could never find anything likable about her. She’s a disgusting pig. I call her the sloppapotamus (a word Mike from Jersey Shore made up that SO PERFECTLY describes Kail).
What.
Am I the only bro who pulls out?
Didn’t she say she is Bipolar? If so impulsive behavior is a symptom during manic phases and she seems to make a lot of impulsive decisions.
Kail’s spiel on having fertility issues is such BS. She was pregnant and had an abortion before Isaac. She’s carried two kids to term. Saying she had to have this baby now is just her way to attempt to lessen blowback. And every women’s fertility lessens with age!!!
Kail is a selfish person. Her kids, especially Isaac, need help dealing with the divorce. But instead mommy is busy boning some dude and got knocked up. Will this guy be yet another faux-dad for Isaac? Poor kid.
These girls need to stop claiming that they have infertility issues. I know literally 1 person who’s ever even gotten tested for fertility issues and that was after 2 years of unsuccessful trying to conceive. Turns out she really can’t get pregnant so it’s just insulting when they claim that they have infertility issues because it takes 2 months to conceive baby number 3.
Just admit you were either trying or didn’t bother with Birth Control. I think a lot of people would respect them more. Instead of lying about a real issue that effects millions of people and is devastating, because you don’t want people to judge you.
I just hope that the new baby daddy goes for full custody and makes Kail pay child support. Wouldn’t that just piss bitchy little Kail off.
This is unbelievable. Poor Javi, poor Isaac, poor Lincoln. Kailyn just beat Jenelle,this news makes me sick.
Is the unhappy, bad childhood such a burden to unable to make your own adult life normal? Is the unhappy childhood forcing to destroy all good on your way?
And M9TV, you helped with ur money to create… Monsters.
Pregnancy at 16 was only a top of a mountain of stupidity, selfishness, and other that should be rather buried not exposed on national tv. Sick.
She has a few friends who pop in and out of the picture but no family at all. What type of support system is she talking about? Let’s just hope this new guy has a family as kind as her other two kids grandparents who babysit and help out as much as they do. And that the new guy is as kind to both of her sons as Joe and Javi are to each other’s children.
So she banged a friend to “see if she could get pregnant”…. WHAT?!
At least she wasn’t caught on a deer cam lol
You are the one who has Isaac so confused..That is what I meant to says
You should think before you act just look how you hurt Isaac…Not Javi Or Joe but you …You are the one who hates him so confused…You are such a Bitch…
Have way threw your pregnancy ?So, you did cheat on Javi…I thought so cause of the way you were acting..That is how my ex-husband husband acted when he cheated on me…Where are your moral ? Have some respect for yourself..
Selfish, entitled, immature, irresponsible, deceitful, tacky, basic, and low. Wanted the wedding but not the marriage. No morals, no values. Changes likes and interests based on whoever she’s currently seeing at the time. What she does with you, she’ll do to you. History has proven that…Can’t keep the same friends. Can’t keep a man. The men in her life are far from perfect but they’ve always tried and stuck around. When you’re the common denominator in all your problems, it’s not everyone else, it’s you. How quickly we forget sleeping in someone’s else’s basement. Getting on government assistance. Driving around in that little get me where I’m going car. And that little apartment you use to call home…but remember what’s here today can be gone tomorrow. You get what you give. Your kids will see this one day. Humble yourself or the world will do it for you.
I was just watching Teen Mom 2 explosive most moments and they showed an argument that erupted between Kail and Javi because he caught her texting another guy. At that time, it did seem that Javi was being too controlling and insecure. Even when he claimed back in August that she cheated while he was on deployment, I thought he was just being paranoid. But I’m starting to think that maybe there really was reason for Javi to believe that she was being unfaithful and he didn’t reveal too much on camera to protect Lincoln. Didn’t she Kail seeing another guy (Jordan) when she was still living at Jo’s house? Then cheated on Jordan with Jo?
And does anyone remember how much contempt she had for Vee? She didn’t want Isaac around her because someone sent her a picture of Vee smoking marijuana. She called Vee disgusting, among other things. (Jo fired back and said Kail was a big pothead, even smoked while she was pregnant with Isaac). So, who’s more stable now? Funny how the tables have turned Kail.
I hated how much she complained when Jo & Vee moved to Delaware to be close to Issac. She was so mean to Jo. I bet she’s happy now that he’s around the corner so she can send Issac at her convenience. Mad props to Vee!!!
3 by 3 shameful
I agree, don’t get why you were down voted for telling the truth
Step right up! Step right up for a ride on Kail’s BabyDaddy Merry – Go – Round! Admission is your ding dang SOUL!
We should make the hussy wear a scarlet A on her chest.
She’s a piece of shit. Poor Javi. His new gf is much prettier and hopefully not so much of a raging cunt with haggard tattoos and a fake ass.
Ok new theory here what if it turns out that she is Bisexual and she will come out and say yea here is my partner and we had a fill in for a baby daddy and the baby daddy is one of her guy friends……Her wording was very very careful so I wonder if that might be why.
Perhaps. But getting pregnant so quickly on the heels of her not yet finalized divorce is still irresponsible Being bisexual does not afford her a pass on that one.
That’s an “MTV Role Model” for you. These girls are all delusional. Who would have ever thought we would see the day when Farrah Abraham is the most responsible of the Teen Moms!? None of these girls were mature enough to congratulate Jenelle when her baby was born, but all of a sudden Kailyn announces and she gets nothing but love, after the way she’s behaved? I guess in Kailyn’s mind as long as she’s happy, nothing and no one else matters? I thought Farrah and Jenelle were selfish, but Kailyn takes the cake with this one. You’d think she would consider the feelings of the babies she already has and slow her role. Isaac was completely devastated over Javi and instead of taking the time to help him through his pain and confusion like a good mother would, this genius decides to get knocked up again and add to his confusion? These “mothers” need to grow the hell up and stop having kids that we all know they won’t be able to afford once the MTV cash stops flowing.
That’s because no decent guy wants Farrah and this bitch is far from being responsible, their all disgusting
I only reason Farrah doesn’t have another kid or two is because no man wants to be tangled up with her nasty attitude and mean spirited, fake self for 18 yrs. Simon is only sticking around for camera time, free MTV meals, and vacations.
I think Chelsea has turned out to be the most stable Teen Mom. She’s a great mother and has found a great partner in Cole. But they can seriously lose the baby voices anytime now.
“I only reason Farrah doesn’t have another kid or two is because no man wants to be tangled up with her nasty attitude…”
Sorry, but no. As hard as it is to say (gulp) Farrah is obviously having responsible sex and realizes it’s not a good time to have another child. Can’t believe I’m saying it, but it’s true. Farrah is clearly having sex. She’s had multiple brushes with boyfriends on the show including Simon, and admitted on a podcast she has had quite a few “flings”. You think all these guys were responsible? That she couldn’t do what I believe a number of the girls did the first time around and lied about being on birth control to have a trap baby? (ie: Chelsea. Sorry again, but I will never in a million years believe Aubree was not planned to keep cheating Adam her high school love. She had at least 2 sisters who were teen moms and knew Randy would support her like he did them. If you look back on her personal FB, she posted about being sooo happy and excited she was pregnant days after finding out. Babies are like, sooo cute and they’ll be a happy lil family!).
Farrah’s attitude on the show is HORRENDOUS, but that doesn’t mean there are thousands of guys who would see her as a meal ticket — ala Jenelle — and be more than happy to give her a baby. Farrah either does not want kids, or knows from experience as a true single mom with a boyfriend she cant complain about being a deadbeat because he’s literally dead, that it’s not an easy undertaking. And for that, I give her credit. And it’s one of the only things I will give her credit for.
Agree with you 100%. Simon hangs on for the fame and would gladly give Farrah a baby if she wanted one just to ensure that she never cuts the purse strings. Let’s not forget that Farrah was Geriatric Matt’s first choice for his 11th Baby Mama. He’s probably jump ship on Ambien right now if Farrah gave him a second look.
Jesus God Kail!
Her life, her body, her decision. I do feel sad for the boys and the baby though.
So how she any better then Jenelle now? I am sorry but I have lost all respect for her. She is so selfish. Married Javi buys an insane house with him and then divorces him cause she doesn’t want more kids. Confuses and hurts Issac with the Javi divorce. Gets a “mommy makeover” free of charge. Now she is pregnant with another guys kid?! So three babies with three baby daddies?! Really!!!
How will she manage? I really feel for the kids, with the divorce I would have thought they needed stability, reassurance and some normality instead of another sibling. I don’t think collecting kids because you may have fertility issues in the future is a good idea.
I always thought Kail was a decent mom despite her general awfulness. No matter how cold-hearted, rude and selfish she was towards everyone else, she seemed to want what was best for her kids and seemed to truly care for them. But nope, clearly not. She wants to get pregnant just for the sake of it, with no care to the environment the child will be brought up in to and her existing family – which is what she preached against, for a reason not to have another baby with Javi. Speaking of Javi, he’s definitely not perfect but ouch. His wife is midway through a pregnancy with another man – who seems to already have passed through – and they’re not even divorced yet. Seriously, she is technically still his wife. She’s lacking a sensitivity chip.
I guess the only decent mom left on the show is Chelsea.
This reminds me that Javi better get this divorce finalized asap. If they are still legally married when this baby is born, he is the presumed father.
I’m 99% sure the divorce was finalized in December I mean I’m sure it doesn’t make it any easier but I think the papers have at least been signed
That’s actually no longer true in the vast majority of states including Deleware. The mother/bio father are on the birth certificate. The state doesn’t fill it out based on marriage records, but on information provided by the parent when filling out forms. This was a concern of Jenelle’s since she was still married to Courtland during Kaiser’s pregnancy and it was confirmed it wasn’t an issue.
Good luck to her finding another relationship after this. Three baby daddies. The guy will obviously need to love kids A LOT, and you’d think a guy like that would then want at least one kid of his own. Who loves kids enough to take on three step kids but doesn’t want their own kid? Good luck Kail!
Aww, don’t worry….she can just move down to the Carolinas in Jenelle’s neck of the woods. The kid-lovin Tinder dudes there are quite plentiful, based on what we see on the show. And they’ll be happy to give her another one within a month of meeting, too!
Oh, how the mighty have fallen. She’s spent so much time on social media criticizing and making underhanded comments about Jenelle, when in reality she *is* just a Jenelle with a degree. Childhood trauma, ya’ll! Childhood trauma. Absent dads, and moms who enjoy their drinks.
She didn’t want to bring a baby in to a bad marriage but she wants to bring a baby in to…no marriage? Not to say you have to be in a marriage to have a baby, but you’d hope you’d at least be with the guy in some kind of relationship in an ideal situation. Or, if you’re doing it alone, you’d think you’d want somebody who you know will be a good father. I’m taking about those who get pregnant purposely, like Kail. Not accidents, which obviously happen. She makes it clear this wasn’t an accident.
It almost would’ve made more sense to have the baby with Javi, but not together. He’s a good dad, loves his kid, and then she wouldn’t have to worry about splitting her kids between now three baby daddies. He wanted another kid, and apparently she did too, so why not make it easier on the family and have a kid with an existing baby daddy?
Is Kail the new Jenelle? I’m shocked at her irresponsibility. It’s all about HER and her wanting a baby, not what would be an ideal environment and family. Sad.
I always really sympathized with Kailyn (I also had a drunk mom who didn’t care at all) but this just goes too far… I’m 21 and even I learned you don’t have to be a certain person just because your parents were shit, I hope she learns that soon enough, especially with another baby on the way.
I sincerely hope she gets her act together for her children. We have seen she can be a good mother, but right now she’s being selfish and not thinking of her other two children. Also, what about the father of the kid??? She’s not with him anymore or??? So another one that passed through to give her a child and then he leaves (or she kicks him out)?? She should know better.
(sorry for any mistakes, I’m Belgian)
I’m sorry to hear you had a hard childhood with a mother likes yours, but I liked the comment, because you said you have learned that’s not what defines you, that you can choose your own course in life. That deserves more than one thumbs up, but that’s all I can give 😉 Also, could you somehow pass that knowledge on to Kail? She clearly didn’t find out yet how to have a stable life…
This was just reckless. She obviously wasn’t with this guy for very long and it sounds like he’s already gone. Poor little Isaac. He is so sweet and sensitive and just doesn’t deserve this kind of instability. Kail seemed like she may have had her head on sort of straight (despite a terrible track record with men and general nastiness). This level of stupidity is just sad. I expected this from Jennelle, not Kail.
Also, when you’ve had two kids by the time you’re 22 (Kail and Maci) NO ONE believes that you have fertility issues. Just stop with that.
While I agree with you, I’m pretty sure she said she had issues AFTER her miscarriage (so after Lincoln was born), not before. While it was kinda dumb from her to just get pregnant with someone she wasn’t with very long, atleast she cares for her children (unlike some others…). But yes, really dumb move :/ I hope her boys don’t suffer from the consequences.
I have a theory (based in kail’s personality & actions, not in fact) that she wanted another kid with no baby daddy ties, so she and a guy agreed that they’d try for a pregnancy so long as she never hit him up for child support. Porsha on RHOA is doing the same thing.
This news seems so odd because Kail would have conceived right around the time that she should have realized how difficult it is to keep track of 2 different custody schedules, how much less her kids are together with her, etc. I think Kail would see a fatherless-baby as the perfect plan to avoid that.
PS hope bot because that is selfish and DUMB DUMB DUMB
I remember something about Kail on holiday acting crazy, crawling on hotel lobby floors drunk with her girlfriends and shouting. That must have been very shortly before she gotten pregnant, because she and Javi had already decided to have a divorce (and it was already made public). So although I do like your theory, I don’t think she had the mindset to first party like a madman on holiday, then think very practically about how to get a third child with the least drama in a matter of days or weeks after that. I think she had made that decision very impulsively.
I hope not as well because a kid needs both parents. And how horrible would it to have 2 siblings with 2 different dads who are both fantastic fathers and you’re like …. I don’t have a father like you guys …. that would be horrible!
Maybe MTV can secure a group rate for tubal ligations for them all, except for maybe Chelsea.
She’s super young for that kind of agreement, though. She must realize that having three children with three baby dadies would make her even harder to eventually have another serious relationship one day.
What I don’t get is when’s Javi was about to be deployed, she complained she would have two kids to take care of alone. She wasn’t alone without any help. Jo and Vee are around the corner to help with Issac. At Kail’s house, you always saw either Javi’s mom or sister in the background helping with both boys. Now what’s she going to do? And the relationships with Javi’s family has to be another loss for Issac. It’s a good thing Jo isn’t working because I have a feeling he is about to be busy with the boys.
It’s been happening to me all of a sudden for the past month. Everything I post is moderated and 90% of the time it never makes the cut. It’s annoying and a bummer because I actually liked commenting here and now all of a sudden my stuff is moderated and not posting. What’s up with that, The Ashley?
Did anyone notice how big she looked when she came back from Hawaii. The whole time I kept saying to myself is she pregnant?
Would she have even been pregnant then, though? [Edit] I just looked it up and she went to Hawaii in late August. She says she’s “almost” mid-term now, so that likely puts her around 4.5 months? Online Due date/conception calculator says the due date would be around mid-June and she likely conceived mid October. Wonder if going back on her social media can clue us in on the dad?
What a dumb hoe lol
All good mothers get pregnant by a random guy before they are even divorced from their husband. That is exactly what mature, responsible, stable mothers do. These girls on this show seem to continue making irresponsible choices,and at this point MTV is just enabling their bad decisions. This show needs to come to an end and these girl need to get a good dose of reality. Absolutely ridiculous!
It also doesn’t help that her friends are all enablers. I may be wrong, but it seems like she doesn’t have anyone in her life that gives her constructive criticism – everyone just supports all of her choices. Her friend Sterling even used emojis to show what the new “Brady Bunch” looks like. Let’s remember that Mike Brady was a widower, ok? Besides, why is this the new “normal”? To the point where people bash those who still believe in, and strive for, a traditional family setting? We can all support Kail, but let’s not pretend that everything is hunky-dory.
It’s hilarious she was ACTUALLY pregnant when someone photoshopped this picture. Fans(and haters) know what’s up. http://www.wetpaint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/kaily-lowry-photoshop.jpg
I thought about that after I read her announcement I was surprised she was so offended by it if by that time she was already pregnant which obviously she was because she said I was off yesterday she was halfway there
I shall repeat what everyone else has already said. It is not her life alone. Her choices affect the two sons she already has. Isaac, for one, has been through hell for a boy so young. He had a strained relationship with his own father because of Kailyn. Then he gets attached to his stepfather; Kailyn kicks him out of Isaac’s life with nary a care about how Isaac would react. She was downright cruel to Javi and Jo, and in my opinion, she used Isaac as a pawn.
Now, she is pregnant by a third her future fertility, but this is not sound or mature decision making that she has engaged in.
Her actions are indefensible, a fact that, in my opinion, she is well acquainted with, hence the defensive stance of her statements.
Yikes my iPad cut out some words!! That last paragraph should have begun “Now she is pregnant by third man out of concern for her future fertility…”
I see she’s using the Maci “I was told I may never get pregnant so we had to just try.” excuse. It’s disturbing.
Well at least Maci was in a stable relationship and only had one baby daddy lol.
It’s a good thing I had my child right before I turned 25. I had no clue how hard it was for those over 25 to conceive. Maci must have just been extra lucky!!
This is a really poor decision Kail has made. It seems this is just too soon after her & Javi’s divorce especially with Issac already struggling with Javi no longer living there. Seems perfectly logical to introduce another man into the chaos, and instantly become pregnant. What is she thinking?!? I noticed immediately what she didn’t say. Not once did she say how happy or excited she was. The whole situation is just strange.
I’m 27, no children yet (and prob not in the nearby future). Good luck to me then I guess.
But I agree, so she was pregnant before the divorce was finalized? I mean Javi can be pissed now and with a good reason. I know she will be a good mom but still, that decision is a wreck. She’s single now, right? So she will have three baby daddies she’s not with, now, hooray. (sarcasm)
This is beyond trashy, 3 different fathers, come on now. She needs to learn about protection. Unless she gets her tubes tied, she will have 4 different fathers. She and Jenelle must be comparing notes. Both of them are trashy and nasty.
Whatever Lola wants, Lola gets. Nomatter who will pay, no regrets.
Right OK… So I don’t normally judge women who have children by different fathers after failed marriages or relationships but.. This is just tacky :/ she hasn’t waited for a stable, established relationship, she’s bed hopped and had a Whoopsie. Let’s hope she gets a girl or baby 4 will be on its way this time next year with the next available guy. The pizza delivery guy.
I hope she has a healthy pregnancy and baby gets here safely, no one deserves that.